Description:What if the most faithful thing we could do right now is simply pay attention?
In this episode of For the Love, Jen and Amy sit down with theologian, ethics professor, and artist Lee C. Camp for a soulful conversation about the kind of faith that wakes us up to what truly matters. As part of our Wake Up Call series on faith, Lee invites us to slow down and notice the world—our lives, our neighbors, and the beauty that keeps trying to reach us.
Together, they explore why paying attention is not a luxury but a spiritual practice—and how our obsession with productivity, planning, and certainty can cause us to miss the most beautiful and formative parts of our lives. Lee reflects on what it means to know ourselves as deeply beloved by God, not because of what we produce but because love is the starting point of a life well lived.
This conversation traces the threads of human flourishing and imagination, and asks why beauty—found in art, nature, poetry, and story—often teaches us more about God than arguments ever could. As he often does on his own No Small Endeavor podcast, Lee challenges us to consider what Christians are being called to wake up to in this season: a renewed attention to community, to creation, and to a church that is something we practice together, not merely something we attend.
If you’re longing for a faith that feels grounded, spacious, and alive—one that helps you live a good life in the world you actually inhabit—this episode is a gentle, necessary wake-up call.
Thought-provoking Quotes:
“What Christianity most needs right now is to rediscover the basics of the beautiful story which we claim to believe.” – Lee C. Camp
The model of the cross means that if we take up our cross and follow Christ, that we can expect difficulty because so much of human history doesn't want that kind of way. Religious powers don't want that. Imperialist powers don't want that. And so we can trust that we're going to have our own kind of crosses to bear along the way. And yet that life has triumphed over death. That love has triumphed over hatred. that beauty and truth and goodness has triumphed over hostility and ugliness and meanness. And so that's the big story.” – Lee C. Camp
I deeply understand why a lot of people just can't believe all this [religious] stuff. But for me, it, the story at its best. is so beautiful that I don't know why everybody doesn't want to believe it, even if they can't believe it. It's this place we embody this narrative, embody this beauty, embody this brokenness in which we try to find tangible ways to do life together.” – Lee C. Camp
Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
Jen Hatmaker on Lee Camp’s No Small Endeavor podcast | Jen Hatmaker: When Everything Breaks: Grief, Growth, and Human Flourishing – https://www.nosmallendeavor.com/jen-hatmaker-when-everything-breaks-grief-growth-and-human-flourishing
No Small Endeavor Podcast – https://www.nosmallendeavor.com/
Munther Isaac: Palestinian Christian Pastor on War, Hope, and Love –https://www.nosmallendeavor.com/munther-isaac-palestinian-christian-pastor-on-war-hope-and-love
Munther Isaac Sermon | Christ in the Rubble – youtube.com/watch?si=zK8OKK_xGMZR64ZD&v=ZPTrmN6Dzmw&feature=youtu.be
Guest’s Links:
Website - https://www.leeccamp.com/home
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/LeeCCamp
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/leeccamp
Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL2Rk2D2fHz5mzmJT8G-x9uO5kyhQiU1N2
Podcast - https://www.nosmallendeavor.com/
The Subtext Podcast – https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-subtext/id1835471106
Connect with Jen!Jen’s Website - https://jenhatmaker.com/
Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/
Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker
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